Hard start, P0340 and P1300 codes

For back story I had a used motor put in in November. 160k miles out of I believe it was an ‘02 or ‘03 4Runner ( I do know throttle bodies were different, mine is cable driven, the new motor was electronic). I *think* some of the wiring had to be redone so that everything would work as intended. I need to talk to the mechanic who did the swap to make sure. Only things that transferred from the old motor to the new were the alternator, starter, and the upper intake/throttle body. All has been going well until the last few months.


To begin with, it cranked like the old motor, a little hard to start at times, but not terrible. Had to hold the key a little long but it would start. The original motor was pulled with 350k miles with the original starter swapped over to the new motor so I attributed the starting to the starter going out and needing to be replaced.


Fast forward to the last few months, the starting issue had gotten worse. Hard to start, and kicking back on the starter. After talking with a trusted mechanic and letting them hear the motor start and run, he suggested the timing was slightly out and that it was the cause of the problem. I took the truck back to the mechanic who originally did the job and mentioned that it sounded like the timing. After looking at it, the mechanic told me it was the cam sensor. No codes were ever thrown, and after searching the forum I realized that a cam sensor isn’t something that just goes out. Instead of buying a new sensor not knowing if it was truly the problem, I robbed the old motor of its cam sensor and had him put it on. When I picked the truck up he said it was starting better, but the starter needed to be replaced. A few hours after having the truck back, it wasn’t starting any better with a different cam sensor. Still hard to start at times (not every single time but majority), kicking back on the starter, but no codes.


Not wanting to deal with the original mechanic who obviously didn’t want to delve into the real problem, I took it to one whom I trust and has done a lot of work for me ever since I’ve owned the truck. Come to find out, the timing was slightly off. Obviously the timing has been fixed, and the truck does idle better than it did before but now it’s throwing a P0340 and a P1300. It’s thrown both at one time, after the truck sat for 4 or 5 days while I did my 4x4 conversion, and it would turn over but never crank. It was then that I swapped the cam sensor back to the one that originally came with the motor and I finally got it to run. It has also thrown both codes separately 2 times in the past week. All four times it threw the codes it was extremely hard to start. It would turn over, act like it was kicking back on the starter some but not as bad as before, at times slow like the starter couldn’t turn it fast enough, and slightly grind every once in a while like the starter teeth may be worn or either not making good contact.



Things to note:

• I have parts coming to rebuild the starter
• If left sitting for a few days the battery is losing charge. It’s around 2 years old
• The idle still isn’t the best, especially in gear. It seems to idle just slightly too low, around 600-650, and it will send a vibration through the truck. It doesn’t this, but not every single time. When in park it does better, but the RPMs will still tend to drop especially if the truck has been running for a while. Again, not every single time (I attribute this to the IAC. When I cleaned it, it still didn’t come completely clean. However, I tested it with a multimeter cold and it appeared to be in factory specs)
• The TB and IAC have been cleaned in the past few months, along with the MAF in the past week.
• The truck did die on me today after being left to sit in Drive and swapping to Reverse. This is the first time this has occurred and it did it twice in a row.
• When starting, it seems to help a little (not much) to barely press the gas pedal to open the butterfly in the TB

I am at a loss as to where to start trying to figure out why it’s throwing both codes. A suggestion that was giving to me is that it seems like something to do with the igniter that is causing it to throw both codes. From what I understand, neither the igniter nor the cam sensors just all of a sudden go out, although my starting problem seems like it is getting more consistent and worse. My plan it to rebuilder the starter to see if there is any improvement at all. Any help and direction that could be given to try and resolve this problem is greatly appreciated!

 

Just what engine are we dealing with??

PO1300 is the ECM is not seeing the signal from the igniter .

It then thinks the engine is not running so turns off the fuel

The PO340 is the cam sensor circuit that will also turn off the fuel

With any DTC codes it is always the complete circuit

Sounds like you need to work through things one step at a time.

Without knowing just How the electrical work was done during the swap it can be frustrating .

It sounds like none of the original sensors were swapped

A 4Runner and Tacoma Engine Harness are different enough to be very interesting .

Unless this engine was the very same as yours the same ECM and Auto the fact it runs at all is pretty good

Have you checked the regional forums you might have people close at hand that live and breathe these trucks

Paying labor on things like this get so very expensive and you still don`t have the truck fixed

I bought a 4Runner like this the last owner had spent a fortune having the engine swapped It took some time to get it up and running like it should

 

Engine is the 3.4.

None of the original sensors were swapped from the old motor to the new. Except for the cam sensor, which I explained in my original post I took back off.

I have not checked with a regional forum, but I certainly will now.

 

Bump for some help and updates.

Talked to the mechanic today who originally did the swap. He said he didn’t have to do anything to the wiring like I originally thought. So *should* rule that out.

Checked the connection at the igniter, all the wires appeared to be secure, dirty and muddy as hell, but secure. However, I did notice that part of the plastic clip that is supposed to keep it secure had broken. I disconnected it and check inside to be sure everything looked ok.

Checked wires going to the coil packs, all seemed to be secure except for the one closest to the front. The small clip holding it to the coil pack had broken, but it still seemed like the connection was solid. (I accidently did this while replacing the plugs with duel ground plugs last week. The issue at hand was going on before the small clip broke)

Checked the Cam sensor with my multimeter, appeared to be in cold spec (1156 ohm)

I did find a loose wire going to what looks like a sensor in the power steering pump. Connector is still there, so I will need to repin it. But I couldn’t see that being the cause of my troubles

I have found through googling that a P0340 could be thrown by a starter not spinning fast enough. Can anyone confirm?

My next steps are

- still rebuild the starter once the parts show up to see if any difference is made.

- check the connection at the ECU?

 

Your saying this swap was done and it never started and ran like it should??

Broken clip could be causing your problem All it takes is one pin not making contact .

As to the Starter spinning to slow then everyone who has a slightly flat battery will have the problem every slow crank

Besides it is not in the Toyota DTC

If you went from a Tacoma to a 4Runner of a different year some things are going to be different !

Unless all the electronics were swapped off your original engine.

Not being up close and in person it is just a guess.

 

It started and ran like it should to me for the first few months, with the exception of what seemed like the starter needing to be rebuilt, and eventually realizing the timing was slightly off. I don’t know if it was set off, or by some freak accident it jumped a tooth or two.

The donor motor came out of an ‘02 4Runner. I know the throttle bodies were different, but what other changes would there have been? Where do I need to look? I’m

I know all of the original electronics were not swapped over, I removed all the sensors I could find from the original motor before I took it to the scrap yard. Also, I’ve swapped the cam sensors with the one that came off of the old motor and that is when it first threw a P0340.

 

Bump. Still need some help. Still haven’t found a solution as of yet. All connections at igniter, ECU and coil packs appear to be good. I haven’t been able to find anywhere where a wire is creating a short nor anywhere where the wire loom looks damaged/Burned. However, I haven’t fully removed the main wiring harness, all the loom and tape to inspect.

One thing I have thought of. For the engine swap, the wiring harness from the ‘02 4Runner was used. Can anyone tell me if there is any difference in the wiring for the igniter between my ‘99 and the ‘02 4Runner? Mainly the way in which it grounds?

 

Update:

Put new contacts and solinoid in the starter.

Replaced ignitor with one from
the junkyard

Swapped out coil packs with packs from the old motor.

Made sure there was clean contact between the ignitor and ignitor bracket, and between bracket and body.

Nothing so far has made a difference. Still is starting the exact same. I would guesstimate that 1/4 of the time it’s starting as it should. The rest of the time it’s hard to start... spins over multiple times, kicks back in the starter, and every once in a while it will slow to a stop for a brief second, and then continue trying to spin over. Almost as if the starter doesn’t have enough juice.

Any help would be great. I’m at a total loss. Only thing I know to do now is take it to a mechanic, or just go straight to the dealer and pray they know how to work on a almost 20 year old vehicle

 

there is something basic that is not correct. Put a voltmeter on the battery and go through the starting proceedure. Low voltage, < 10.5 while cranking is an indication of an issue in the "starting system". I would google a video on how to do a voltage drop and I would start with the cable on the starter to the battery. If the voltage is low the ECU/igniter will act flakey. Verify that the ground from the battery to block, grounds on the D/S intake are good and the ground from the back of the P/S cylinder head is attached to the firewall.

 

I will look into doing a voltage test on start up. Judging by my ultra gauge, I would assume the voltage would be fine.

As for the grounds, everything appears to be fine. I recently added the ground from the cylinder head to the firewall
Because it has been gone for a very long time. I have double check all other grounds and all appear to be good, block to battery, battery to body, and from the bolt that holds the dipstick to the motor to the body. No loose connections. All in 0/2 gauge with heavy duty connectors. Including the alternator positive to the battery positive.

As for the D/S intake ground, I assume your referring to the ground on the front D/S intake directly above the spark plug? If so, I know that one is marking good connection at the intake. Is there another one that I’m missing?

 

Bump. Still need help. Still haven’t found a solution. I have a new cam sensor coming that I am putting in to see if it makes any difference.

I’ve checked all the grounds I know of and everything appears to be secure, perhaps I’m missing a ground somewhere?

I’ve always been watching my voltage on my Ultra Gauge and it doesn’t appear to drop below 10.5 upon starting.

Going to preform a compression test this week to insure everything is good.

 

Installed a new cam shaft sensor yesterday, because several people have alluded to the starting issue sounding like it was missing the cam sensor reading. The sensor was not OEM, but after market. After installing, first start and it threw the P0340 code. I uninstalled it and put the original back in.

Also, while I had the cover off, I rotated the crank bolt clockswise to line up the crankshafts to see if the timing makes were in line. Now, with the after market sensor or with the OE sensor, it’s running worse than it ever has. Sputtering, and if giving it a quick blip of gas, it almost wants to cut off. I’m giving up and taking it to a dealer in hopes they will have someone with enough sense to figure out what is going on.

 

Bump. Still looking for any kinda of help. Truck has been at the dealer this week, but still no answers.

 

No one has any other suggestions? Truck has been at the dealer for 3 weeks, all they know is computer and ignitor both appear to check out fine. If it’s not looked at this week, I’ll more than likely go to a plan b....

 

I looked through the factory manuals that I have, 1996, 2000, 2003 on the P1300 code and what I was afraid of came true... the ECU's are different as the diagnostics via pin outs on the ECU itself. If you need to proceed on your own you are going to need a wiring manual for that exact year and it even appears that a CA truck is different than a 49 state truck.
Looking at the common things in the wiring you need to have battery voltage at pin 9 which looks to be a brown/red wire. There appears to be some mis-information between the manuals as to the color of the ground wire off of the igniter... one manual shows a white wire, one shows a brown wire but they all show the igniter being grounded at the mulit ground point on the intake manifold. Take a decent jumper wire with alligator clips and make a temporary ground link between the intake manifold ground the the battery ground. I have seen where after 20 years the corrosion of all of the parts in between the intake ground and the battery causes a voltage drop.

 

Thanks! I’ll give the temporary jumper a try if I end up going and getting the truck. I did get a wiring diagram for the ignitor circuit for my exact year and I believe the ground is brown. And after looking at it, it would appear so because the brown wire in the wiring harness is a slightly large gauge than the rest.

 

Hm, truthfully I notice toyota's connectors break easily so its kinda hard to blame that on the mechanice who did the engine swap.

i would inspect, clean and add di-electric grease to any connectors. Inspect to see if you're within spec of fuel pressure, the igniter is working as it should, ohm test the wiring back to the ecu. All within the FSM's specs. Factory (not haynes) Service Manual.

 

^^ what he said plus this http://www.fluke.com/fluke/uses/com...articlecategories/electrical/diagnosevoltdrop

 

I had inspected and cleaned the connection at the ignitor. It did not appear to be broken, and none of the wires felt loose in the connector. The dealer has at least confirmed that the ignitor is in working order. However, I did not clean the connector at the camshaft sensor but I did inspect it to insure the wires were not loose in the connector. I checked the connections at the ECU and everything appeared fine. The dealer has also confirmed that the ECU appears to be in working order.

I had not tested fuel pressure or compression, and I did not ohm test the wiring back to the ECU because I could not find the exact information I needed. One of the reasons why I gave up and dropped it at the dealer.

 

Update: had the truck back for a week now and everything appears to be fine. The dealer concluded that the timing was still 4 teeth off. The ECU, Ignitor, and wiring harness all checked out fine.

However, after getting it back from the dealer, it still didn’t want to start correctly, and thew the p1300 code. I decided to go ahead and the place the starter wth a remain. Ever since putting the new starter on, it starts better than it has in a very long time. No codes, and I have driven this truck 10-12 hours a day for work. So, in my situation, replacing the contacts and solenoid in the starter did not help.

Hope the frustrating venture helps someone in the future.