For those of you who have a winch-do you have circuit breaker/fuse protection?

Wiring a new purchase. Have done some research on here and abroad but cannot find a consensus about whether to protect the battery cable. I am putting a switch in, but should I include a fuse? Seems some manufacturers don't include anything and others a simple relay block (mine did the latter.) I am thinking a 200 amp Bussman circuit breaker is in order but there is a room crunch; so, what says the hive mind? Any electrical engineers/Linemen/electricians that care to weigh in?

 

I personally ran into this last month I did not have to use protection and something went wrong with the winch itself and not knowing to me it was pulling a 10 amp draw and killing my battery within 20 minutes after a full charge so it’s best you have something like that in place as I learn the hard way

 

I'm only using the fuses that came with my ARB compressor, no circuit breaker disconnect. Another couple pennies of info, make sure your truck is running when you're using the winch.

 

Thanks for that. I grew up wheeling with my oldest brother and his FJ (back in the 70's) and he always had the thing running when using the winch. Watching videos where guys do it without the engine on amazes me... will it start???

 

Winches can pull so many amps that you kind of can't reasonably fuse them or circuit break them, my solution to this as you can see if you look closely near the bottom of this picture I keep my positive lead to the winch coiled up out of the way and disconnected from the battery and the appropriate wrench to connect to the accessory lug on the positive terminal when I hit the dirt.



After seeing a nice built rig that burned down because the winch lead had wore through the sheathing and direct grounded to the body I don't want to risk it.

 

Back then alternators probably didn't have automatic over voltage protection built it so it was safer to shut the engine down so the alternator didn't burn up, these days "will it start" is the bigger issue thanks to so much standard and added electronics and built in micro smart solid state circuits it's better to let it all run.

That is my guess anyway.

 

Yes-I am going to use a marine style on off switch. It is a three position as I am doing a receiver plate style front and rear with power in the back as well as front. Do you think this is enough-having no power in the line until use?

 

I put in a Blue Seas 600 amp switch, no fuse or breaker. I turn it on when necessary.

 

Fusing the winch requires a fuse that won't blow at regular operating amps (250-350A or higher) which means there isn't a ton of short protection.

I used an SB350 quick disconnect for the winch leads rather than a switch style disconnect - it was cleaner for my application and it means I can completely isolate the winch and also use it as a jumper cable and external charger hookup if needed. It's also just about impossible for it to fail (although a quality battery disconnect is admittedly unlikely to fail).

 

Definitely better than nothing and an option I have seen done and even considered myself but ultimately decided against it as if you read the packaging most can typically only handle like 400 amps at 12v for 1-2 minutes before getting melty whereas a winch can draw 600amps when really working it and a winch session might be 5 minutes or more if you're really stuck or have to climb some rocks and re-pick along the way out/up so didn't want to risk over loading the marine switch.

They're more so for isolating the deep cycle starting batteries from parasitic draw and still being able to start which usually only pulls high amps for very short durations unlike winching.

My SDHQ 'quick connect' accessory terminals and a wrench in the box with the winch remote is my compromise.



Alternator and starter conductors are disconnected here as I was upgrading the primary current carrying conductors when I took that picture but it shows the terminal well enough.

Good stuff.

 

I use a Blue Sea L-series solenoid between the battery and winch. 450 amp continuous rating, 600 amp for five minutes, 1000 amp for thirty seconds. The solenoid is controlled via a switch in the cab so that the cables aren't hot when I'm not using the winch. The winch circuit is protected with a 600 or 700 amp ANL fuse. I'm away from my truck and can't remember for sure.

 

Sounds like a decent option pending price and complexity.

Seen some of the bigger switches and what not like that which might handle high semi continuous winch amps loads but at the end of the day removing one bolt and attaching one lead is significantly cheaper and easier than installing a remote switch in the cab with much less potential to fail plus a manual under the hood switch is already halfway to what I've been doing so figured may as well save a couple hundred on the hardware and wires as well as time running everything.

I still probably wouldn't have broken even on time of installing all that vs hooking up as needed.

I suppose it comes down to how often you need to use your winch.

For me maybe a hand full of times a year at most but when I need it boy am I glad I have it.

 

A fuse seems unnecessary. A disconnect switch will more suit the goal you are after. Fuse coordination will prove to be a challenge to provide a compromise between reliability and availability. In an industrial setting, you rarely see a DC motor that is fused, TOL and/or an 87 type relay that trips a breaker is a common control scheme.

you must ask yourself this question, are you trying to save the winch, or your truck with this fuse. Only then will you come up with the answer. Personally I think a nice TM breaker with an inverse time curve would be great option but the cost and feasibility to implement would be unfavorable for most. I compromised and went with a disconnect that I leave open unless using the winch and put it as close to the battery as I could get (<1ft).

 

You really want to fuse or circuit breaker the winch.

Motors, can and will draw current to the point of failure if allowed.

With that, over current protection, (fuse, breaker), isn't there to protect the equipment. It's there to prevent the wires from burning up.

 

You have answered my question then to the OP, you will want to protect the truck. In most cases it is ideal to have a form of OC protection. In cases where emergency use is required, the use of a manual override for thermals or trips are warranted. In the case of a winch, you are needing in an emergency and will not be needing nuisance trips causing a failure. Therefore it is imperative that you keep the design simple as possible to ensure it is reliable. In this case, a fuse or breaker can provide a benefit but more times than not will prove to not be beneficial. With a manual disconnect, the majority of the wiring remains protected by the use of manual isolation.

 

In every case, OCP Should be installed.

In some cases, fire pumps for example, can have OCP up to 400x the motors rating. Considering it's job, you want it to run to failure. Damn close to it anyways. You don't want to do that to the winch.

Assuming properly sized OCP, there will be no need to bypass it, emergency or not.

Protection through isolation isn't protection for anything other than you while working on the winch.

Whatever the winch current rating is, I wouldn't fuse it more than 2x it's rated current. Even with that, I'm a lil nervous about the windings overheating and shorting out.

 

You should email every winch manufacture and let them know then, because they don't ship a fuse with one or recommend to install. I'm not talking about proper sizing, but for conditions during a failure. you answered my other question, winches are worked on very seldom and if a fault occurs while the winch is working there will be additional damage sure, but at minimal cost compared to no manual lockout.

 

A typical squirrel cage motor can draw 5-7x starting current, I've not measured a winch motor to see if same holds true for a DC or if there is a resistor on the motor starter. To fuse for 3500 amps is unrealistic.

 

An active member on here - @Gilmorec61 - sells the blue sea switch with a bracket and 2g lead you can mount right next to the battery: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...witch-bracket-protect-your-investment.619464/ - it's a good read as he makes the case for the switch and the amp draw. I like this option b/c you simply leave it off most of the time. 900 amps for 30 seconds. 500 amps for 5 minutes. 300 amps continuous.

 

I've got a 200A surface mount breaker literally on top of the battery (between the posts) with the pos lead only a few inches to the breaker. And keep it tripped until using the winch.