2nd gen - 3 way component system install, anyone done it?

I’m in the process of planning my stereo for my 2015 and I’m curious to see how others mounted a 3 way system. I’m specifically interested in the Morel Virtus 603 but would love to see any photo of a 3 way setup. I believe the mid range could fit in the factory tweeter location, and the tweeter could be mounted in the sail panels. At this point I’m trying to gauge how much custom fab work would be required and if the sq gains are worth the effort. I’m also debating active vs passive crossovers but that’s a different debate.

 

i believe there's been a couple of them. there's also been a couple where they install a coaxial speaker in door tweeter location as an alternative. it's all about the effort you're willing to put into it, and what you're expecting back out of it.

if you haven't yet, try to locate a local shop that might have some 3-way speakers available for demo.

i had been hard-set on doing a 3-way setup in a previous car, and then had the chance to demo some hertz and jl 3-way vs. 2-way variants. for the most part, the midrange tends to enhance the vocals. sometimes naturally, sometimes unnaturally.

after going back and fourth on a few different sets, i decided for myself that the extra installation complexity wasn't worth the effort for my expectations.

the other thing to keep in mind is that the most ideal stereo system would be only 2 speakers that respond perfectly to all frequencies. physics keeps that from happening, but for every speaker that's added that's not precisely at the exact same distance in fractions of an inch, and at the exact same angle as the other speaker, it creates a phase and arrival-time difference to the listener, which effects the output.

2-ways only have 2 points of complexity. 3-ways add an additional speaker that adds even more phase and time alignment issues.

so that said, i would absolutely recommend a dsp with full active crossover and time alignment capablities for all installations. 2-way, or 3-way, but definitely almost a requirement for 3-way setups-- either an additional piece, or as part of the amp, like audio controls matrix-dsp amps for example.

3-way does add a lot more complexity with 6 total amplification channels needed for full-active, but the dsp functionality is well worth that effort if you decided that 3-way has a significant benefit.

the main thing i always use dsp's for is for environment-based crossover adjustment. every included crossover for a passive crossover setup is built around ideal settings. vehicles are anything but ideal. and the crossovers that they design don't always align with the reality we're trying to use the speakers in.

 

Thanks for the super informative reply. I’ve been doing more research myself and I’m leaning towards a high quality 2 way system for a lot of the reasons you mentioned. I have a bit of experience tuning but not 3 way and it definitely seems like there’s more to go wrong. I also can’t think of a clean location or way to mount the mid range. Seems like the Audiofrog GB60 and GB15 are solid choices now, with the 1.5” tweeter helping eliminate the need for a mid. I’m planning on running them active with each having its own channel on the amp. I’m thinking the built in DSL in either the Sony XAV-9000es or Kenwood Excelon Reference head unit I’m gonna get will eliminate the need for a separate DSP module or a DSP amp. What setup did you go with on your Tacoma?

 

you'd need to check the specifications, but i don't believe the kenwood has a network mode. i don't see anything on the product page to indicate it can do more than basic head unit functions. the sony is slightly nicer in that it has a parametric eq, and a network mode.

i can see the sony has a parametric eq
https://www.reddit.com/r/CarAV/comm...y_xav9000es_the_only_head_unit_out/?rdt=63831

digging deeper, i do see that the sony has a 2-way mode, but one of the caveats of headunit-built-in crossovers is that they're generally limiting in which frequencies they'll allow-- this comes into play massively when you depart from the standard 1" tweeter/6" woofer setup that most people run. this link is an owner complaining that the 2-way modes lowest crossover point is 1khz.
https://www.reddit.com/r/CarAV/comments/19azf1k/sony_crossover_question/

i don't know much about kenwood's, but if the kenwood has a network/2way/crossover mode, it'll very likely have a similar issue. my pioneer does the same thing.

i personally love larger format mid/tweeters. i feel they bring the sound stage up more than tweeters only in most vehicles. but the biggest issue with trying to do so is that it's considered 'non-standard' by most of the industry, so the settings needed to run them aren't always available in head units, or even some amplifiers.

it's really the exact reason that i like to try to run a dsp when i can-- so i can play with any crossover or eq settings whenever i decide that what i'm hearing isn't good enough.

as another example, in my old ranger install, i ran dayton audio 1x5 dual motor drivers as mid/tweeters. they're far larger than standard tweeters, so 1khz is far higher than the lowest they'll play, but many standard head unit crossover settings max out at 200hz, leaving the gap from 200hz-1khz. those 'twiddlers' played great with a 500hz crossover. this is the good/bad thing about running oddball gear. it gives you the chance to tune your audio exactly to what you want, but it's also important to know and understand the limitations of the gear you're installing.


in that ranger install, i ended up putting in a dayton dsp408 dsp unit to get the crossover points i wanted, and entirely ignored the radios 2-way mode selection. the dayton dsp408 has it's own issues, mostly related to it's low price point. the higher one goes in the price spectrum, the better support and tuning ease there is. the dayton model leaves everything up to the end user to figure out-- it's capable of it, but there are no tools to tune it automatically. many options from audio control as an example, cost more but integrate with their software to automatically adjust settings for the most ideal sound. much of it just comes down to the 'level of fussing' you want to do with the system--pay less for the gear, but more in your personal time setting it up, or more for the gear, with less time later setting it up...

my tacoma is currently in limbo. other projects interrupted things, so i just got it to a point of being good enough until i can clear my project backlog some more. currently i'm running a pioneer 80prs headunit in network mode to some Amazon/ali-express ring radiator tweeters(knockoff of peerless ring radiators), and peerless 6" hds nomex door speakers. eventually it'll get the dayton dsp408 added in, as well as an alpine pdx v9 amp that will run the the peerless front door mids, the dash tweeters(model pending my boredom/curiosity), plus an sb acoustics 10" shallow sub with a 10" css passive radiator.

 

I appreciate all the info again. Sounds like it’s going to be a sweet setup in your Taco. That’s a good point though about
making sure I know the limitations of the head units DSP. I think either should work for my use case though and if I just do an active 2 way up front + subwoofer, it’s a pretty basic setup. Of course if I wanted to expand I’d definitely need a dedicated DSP. Here’s what I found in the manual for the Kenwood. Seems like it would work running my tweeters of the front channel, door woofers rear, and sub to sub channel.


I’m somewhat set on getting these Audiofrog GB15 1.5” tweeters but it seems they are a bit too large and deep for the stock location. Have you ever ran a larger tweeter? I’m thinking I could just drill out a large hole in the door panel so I could mount a deeper tweeter in the stock location or maybe just do some custom work on the sail panels. I the sail panels location is better but I think a close to 2” deep tweeter would look weird there.

 

i have ran larger 1-1/8" tweeters before, but they were dayton audio's nd28f, which are extremely shallow. i ended up running them in the lower a-pillars, and firing horizontally across the dash--in a 3rd gen eclipse, with massive a-pillar plastics. even those were a somewhat tight fit. for a tweeter closing in on 2" in either dimension, you're really in the area of making your own tweeter pods somewhere-- there's just not enough meat in most speaker locations to be hiding that much bulk.