07 Tacoma need help diagnosing problem with P0012 code

Thanks In advance but I had code P0012 come up camshaft position A timing over retarded on bank 1 (vvt solenoid) I believe,well got the part changed it code came up again thinking I didn’t get the wire snapped in all the way i did everything again and kept throwing the code so I took it to Toyota so they could diagnose it they told me the 90% of the time that code comes up the timing chain is stretched I’ve had to drive the truck since and now especially when it’s not warmed up I can hear chattering pretty bad I don’t know if I should take the solenoid back for a new one and also I still couldn’t get a good click in when connecting the plug while replacing it or should I replace the timing chain, when it gets into engine work I’m not the greatest so I’ll be taking it to the shop I’m lost and I love my truck so anyone with a similar problem or any knowledge will be much appreciated!

 

Miles? Timing chain being stretched is usually code P0016. At least you have some noise, usually the tensioner keeps it tight enough to prevent noise. Check the cover with a Mechanics stethoscope to see it that is where the noise is coming from.

 

I’m at like 149,000 miles and ok I’ll look into that I appreciate it I hope it’s not the timing chain but the chattering is noticeable like I said especially when the engine is cold and at idle which I heard is common that it would mess with the idle with that solenoid going out I’m getting a new solenoid to be sure and bank 1 would be passenger side I believe and it’s only one bolt and 1 connection the only thing is when I changed it it didn’t wanna snap into the connecter so I had to try and make it so that’s the only thing I keep thinking about maybe poor connection and if it’s not that then I’m back to square 1

 

Each solenoid which is also known as an Oil Control Valve has a filter.
It’s possible the filter screen is plugged with debris. Or you may have a worn cam gear.
If a new solenoid (OCV) doesn’t help, you might try to replace the filter.

Other than than that, the diagnosis is going to get involved.
And likely will result in the valve covers coming off to check the timing.

 

Oil Control Valve Filter locations one on each side and it looks like a bolt head covering it:
They can be a pain in the ass to get out, patience wins the race.

 

Speaking of VVT/ OCV/ CMP issues, I'm actually having some issues at take off involving stumbling without codes that's making me wonder if it's actually clogged screens as well.

I'm going to remove them from the setup entirely and move on with life. If the issues persist I'll just replace both VVT/ OCV/ CMP's and then really move on with life and enjoy the truck the way it's supposed to be.

 

Not recommended, but it's your truck.

 

It's usually timing chain.

The noise is the tensioners over compensating for the stretched chain.

If ignored it will eventually cost you a lot more money.

 

I'm not saying this as to come off argumentative, but tell me why I shouldn't?

Case and point example as to my line of thinking behind this. GM actually rolled out a TSB to remove the filter screens entirely as they we're causing a lot of issues on their OCV/ VVT valves and that was the field fix for it.



Next example which is somewhat related, but not in the same system, transmission valve body solenoids from the factory have them and usually wind up getting clogged as well, causing issues. In the aftermarket offerings of them, they come with those screens removed without causing any penalty, issue, or harm of functionality. I have personally spoken with the engineers for these solenoids and asked why their solenoids came without screens on them and was informed that "they caused issues and we're deemed unnecessary." Pretty similar stuff to the above statement by Holden/GM engineers.

Me personally, I see no reason to maintain those screens in place only to cause myself complications to the systems functionality. That's what oil filters are in place for.

 

Well firstly I don't hold GM Engineering in a very high esteem, I have worked on far too many of their vehicles. The big difference is these GM OCV filters you speak of are in the solenoid valves themselves. Their problem is the filter breaking and rotating in the valve restricting oil flow/pressure.

Toyota OCV Filters are not part of the solenoid valves, but are separate components.

What the actual problem is:

https://www.etponline.com.au/vvt-rattles-in-holden-1.8l-z18xer-f18d4/

If Toyota comes out and recommends removal I would consider it.

It doesn't take much to make a hydraulic spool valve jam open, closed or some where in between.

Maintain the lubrication system and you will not have any issues other than normal wear and tear. If you notice the vast majority do not have any issues for hundreds of thousands of miles.

And as I stated: It is your truck do as you wish.

 

@Tyler275 can you enlighten us as to the oil change history?

 

@Taco’09 I got the truck late on mileage like 135,000 I myself keep up with it but before hand don’t really know but never had any kind of problem until this code came up thinking easy fix and changed it and still throwing the same code now like I said chattering has started

 

I don't respect GM just as much as any other logical man of the trade like yourself. With saying that, I am also willing to accept that their engineering and tech is at the forefront of technology and automotive design, (integrity and reliability is another thing, however) and sure while the design of the filtration may be different, the concept is still the same. Toyota is in the stone age in comparison with their "if it ain't broke don't fix it" engineering and tech, so any crap they put out I take with a serious grain of salt.

If aftermarket parts for Toyota solenoids no longer incorporate the design and there are TSBs for other manufacturer's mentioning that it is redundant I'm more than willing to give it a shot myself.

I'll let you know if my engine explodes.

 

How's it holding up so far without the OCV filters?

 

Never did pull them out. Too difficult to get to them with my setup so I passed on doing it. I just replaced my OCV/ VVT solenoids and called it a day.

If I ever get to a point where I have things apart enough for it to be easier to get to then I will pull them, for now I'm running them as is.